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Re: [Phys-l] Federally mandated homework



On 11/04/2011 11:14 AM, Edmiston, Mike wrote:

I would say I measure quality of product.

Good.

My student's don't get any
credit for spending 10 hours on a lab report.

Good.

They get credit for
turning in a good lab report. If it's good, I don't care if they
cranked it out in 30 minutes or 10 hours.

Good.

I am close enough to my
students to know it's a rare student who can go from raw data to a
good report in 30 minutes, yet I have a fair number of students who
think they can do a good report in 30 minutes. They don't get good
grades, and are apt to complain that the only way to get a good grade
in my class is to spend more time than they have available.

Yes, that's all-too-typical.

They're
correct that they need to spend more time. They're not correct that
the time is unavailable. They might be correct if they say their
other courses don't require as much time.

Agreed.

That's where I have my problem.

We agree, that's definitely a problem.

I don't like it when the average student thinks my classes
require too much time. They would be less likely to say this if
their other professors held them to a higher quality of product that
required them to spend similar time to what they spend for my
courses. So it's not that I want the other profs to require
busy-work to get more time-on-task. Rather, I want the other profs
to require a quality of product for which the average student needs
to spend a reasonable amount of time on the product.

IMHO that is not the right way to deal with the problem.

As for the other classes requiring less time, you and the student
should rejoice, not protest. It means there is more time available
for this class ... but still that is not the conversation you want
to be having.

For every minute you spend talking to the student about "time on
task" you're just digging yourself -- and the student -- into a
deeper hole. You're teaching the wrong lesson about life.

Maybe the student /wants/ to frame the question in terms of time
on task, but you should not take the bait. Here's an alternative:

Dear student: Think about what your life will be like in a year
or so. You're applying for a job. On your résumé you say "hire
me, because I took a physics course that didn't require very much
homework." That's ridiculous. The employer doesn't care how much
time you did or didn't spend on homework. The employer cares about
what you know and what you can do.

You're paying a gazillion dollars a year in order to go to a fancy
private school. I would have thought you would want to learn
something while you are here. I guarantee that even if you work
hard, everything you learn in school will be only a tiny percentage
of what you need to know in the real world, and no matter how much
you learn, you will wish you had learned more.

If you're not interested in learning the material, drop the course.
No hard feelings. Don't go away mad, just go away.

If you do want to learn the material, you will have to spend some
time and effort. I'm doing everything I can to make the learning
as quick and painless as possible. If you know of an easier way to
learn the material, please let me know. I'm pretty sure that blowing
off the homework will not make the material any easier.

If the student absolutely insists on having a discussion of "time on
task", there is another line of defense:

Dear student: I'm assigning you some homework right now. Make a
pie chart showing how you spend your time on a weekly basis. There
are 168 hours in a week.
-- Show how much time you spend sleeping.
-- Show how much time you spend bathing and dressing.
-- Show how much time you spend shopping and dining.
-- Show how much time you spend commuting.
-- Show how much time you spend in church each week.
-- Show how much time you spend in other classes.

This will make it clear to me /and to you/ what is important in your
life. If your week is so full of high-priority activities that you
cannot spend 9 hours per week on this 3-credit course, then I congratulate
you. Drop the course and go do what's important to you. If learning
this subject is important to you, stay. If it's not important, don't
waste your time and my time by pretending it is.

============

In many cases, the fundamental problem is that the student's only goal
is to get through the class. As long as you allow that to be the goal
and the topic of conversation, you're losing. Even if you win the battle
you have already lost the war.

Do not engage that topic. As long as that is the topic, the student
can achieve his goal by browbeating you into dumbing down the course.

In contrast, the smart strategy is to change the topic. Get the student
to think about getting through life, not just getting through the course.

Dear student: I'm here to help you. You are paying me to prepare you
to get through life. Dumbing down the course makes it easier to get
through the course, but makes it harder to get through life. It defeats
the purpose of going to school.

One more bit of advice: Since this is evidently a chronic problem, it
may help to deal with it proactively, e.g. by passing out a written notice
on the first day of class, notifying everyone that the course will require
time and effort. For a 3-unit course, half of the students will need to
spend *more* than 9 hours per week. As part of the first homework, make
'em certify that they read the notice. This way nobody can complain that
they were surprised.