Re: [Phys-l] Was, reading PER literature

[Jack Uretsky <jlu@hep.anl.gov>]

Hi all-
	I agree with "stopped reading too soon".  The familiar tactic is 
to trivialize a concern by focussing on an irrelevance; in the classic
pathology between spouses, the response to a spousal concern is "you're so 
beautiful (handsome) when you're angry!" (I've even had this from a class 
I chewed out for not preparing for a test!).
	The operative comment, from one who should know, was:
"The paradox is this: as a lingering result of the golden age, we still 
have the finest scientists in the world in the United States. But we also 
have the worst science education in the industrialized world."
	We have met the enemy, Bernard, and it is high time to admit that 
he is us!
					Reply,
						Jack


On Sat, 9 Dec 2006, Bernard Cleyet wrote:

> Comment from only reading the first three (two?) paragraphs.  Like the
> famous turn of the cent. (19/20) Physicist, I think he spoke too soon --
> since then there has been an explosion, tho minor, in cosmology and
> related Physics -- e.g. neutrino mass, and dark energy -- the U. is
> accelerating its expansion.  Also in equip., e.g. STM and AFM.
>
> bc, prob. stopped reading too soon.
>
> Rauber, Joel wrote:
>
> > Is this it
> >
> > http://www.its.caltech.edu/~dg/crunch_art.html
> >
> > Regardless, its interesting
> >
> > ________________________
> > Joel Rauber
> > Department of Physics - SDSU
> >
> > Joel.Rauber@sdstate.edu
> > 605-688-4293
> >
> >
> >
> > | -----Original Message-----
> > | From: phys-l-bounces@carnot.physics.buffalo.edu
> > | [mailto:phys-l-bounces@carnot.physics.buffalo.edu] On Behalf
> > | Of Jack Uretsky
> > | Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 12:41 PM
> > | To: Forum for Physics Educators
> > | Subject: Re: [Phys-l] Reading PER literature
> > |
> > | There was a talk (copied on the web) by Goodstein (Cal Tech)
> > | pointing out that the US is doing graduate science education
> > | for the world, while U.S.
> > | students can't make it into our grad schools.  He was
> > | deploring the state of US undergard education.  He was
> > | certainly knowledgeable about the admissions policies
> > | respecting physics grad students at Cal Tech.
> > |  				Regards,
> > |  					Jack
> > |
> > | On Wed, 6 Dec 2006, John Clement wrote:
> > |
> > | > One interpretation is that there is a problem with
> > | education in their
> > | > countries.  It could be that the prestigious schools there
> > | are full,
> > | > or the social climate here is alluring.
> > | >
> > | > As to superiority of American schools, this is often a self
> > | fulfilling
> > | > prophesy.  When a school is considered superior people send their
> > | > budding geniuses there and viola, it has better test scores
> > | and superior graduates.
> > | > My kids school is precisely one of those.  Schools ratings are
> > | > actually completely independent of the education.  They
> > | don't do good
> > | > pre and posttesting to see if the graduates have "learned"
> > | more.  It
> > | > is the old computer adage GIGO "garbage in garbage out" or in this
> > | > case genius in, genious out.
> > | >
> > | > John M. Clement
> > | > Houston, TX
> > | >>
> > | >>
> > | >> | > Keep talking about how more and more physics & science grad
> > | >> | > students
> > | >> | are
> > | >> | > from other countries.
> > | >> | > Fine.  Do something about it.  Teach differently.
> > | >> |
> > | >> | Hmmm.  But many of them study here, so what does THAT say?
> > | >> | --- That says that our schools are good.  It doesn't say
> > | that there
> > | >> | is no room for improvement in teaching methods.
> > | >> |
> > | >>
> > | >> There are, of course, other interpretations of that data that are
> > | >> likely to be of equal value.
> > | >> _______________________________________________
> > | >
> > | >
> > | > _______________________________________________
> > | > Forum for Physics Educators
> > | > Phys-l@carnot.physics.buffalo.edu
> > | > https://carnot.physics.buffalo.edu/mailman/listinfo/phys-l
> > | >
> > |
> > | --
> > | "Trust me.  I have a lot of experience at this."
> > |  		General Custer's unremembered message to his men,
> > |  		just before leading them into the Little Big Horn Valley
> > |
> > |
> > |
> > | _______________________________________________
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> > | Phys-l@carnot.physics.buffalo.edu
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> > |
> > _______________________________________________
> > Forum for Physics Educators
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--
"Trust me.  I have a lot of experience at this."
		General Custer's unremembered message to his men,
		just before leading them into the Little Big Horn Valley