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Re: [Phys-L] Economist Kern Alexander Explains the Problem with School Choice




a) Public Education is very much about 'economic good' your particular definition of 'public good' not withstanding. A good example is that much of the impetus for providing public education to women during the Industrial Revolution was to have educated (low wage) citizens.

b) Talk to elementary and middle-school teachers (I do almost daily). The ones I talk to are firmly convinced that parents are the number one problem with education--the ones NOT supportive of their children's education--often downright antagonistic about it. [I'm sure many of us 'old-timers' can give anecdotal evidence to the fact that 'good education' in the distant past (1950s) was not nearly so hampered by parental attitudes and other 'interferences'.]

c) "On the other hand it ignores the fact that all those supposedly untrustworthy parents still control much of their children lives -- from providing health care to nutrition, shelter,and raising their children" HERE is exactly the problem--too many parent aren't doing this..at least not up to earlier societal standards. Again the tax payers are feeding many--looking out for their nutrition. Children are allowed to leave home on frigid mornings with insufficient clothing. If they were 'raising' their children (again by maybe older but reasonable standards) there wouldn't be as many problems. (I don't claim everything would be fine--just a lot better.) Getting lawyers ('my mom will sue you' is a too often heard refrain) and psychologist (it's not their fault they failed--having 10% of a 50 person college class diagnosed with learning disabilities for example) would help too.

BTW--'untrustworthy' is your word, not mine. The reasons for the 'parental' problems are many and varied and will not be easy to 'fix'. Blame is not the game--changing attitudes towards education is!

rwt


----- Original Message -----
Public good is considered a "public good" if it has the attributes of
non-excludability and non-rivalry. Classical examples are defense, air
quality, and a handful of others. Clearly, education is easily
excludable. One can easily educate some people and exclude others --
in
fact, we do it all the time, even if not necessarily intentionally
(smile). Similarly, education does not have the attribute of
non-rivalry. If we spend more on some subset of students (e.g.,
students
with disability, or middle-class students), clearly less is left over
for others, given finite resources available to education. Again, we
see
the rivalry inherent in education all the time around us.

I understand that you want to treat education as something that is
good
for the whole public. Nothing wrong with that, but it is not a "public
good" in the economic sense and hence arguments that it inherently
must
be provided by the public are inapplicable. In fact, Sweden is
precisely
an example why education is not a "public good" in the economic sense.
Consequently, it is correct to argue about education based on its cost
and its quality when provided by government or by the free market, and
the philosophical implication either of them creates, rather than
attempt and close-off the discussion under the "public good" label.

Which brings me to your comment that perhaps we can trust parents in
<fill in the blank place> and cannot trust parents in the U.S. This is
not only patronizing, it is simply wrong. On one hand it assumes that
there are no ignorant or backward people in Sweden while we somehow
have
a large number of them. On the other hand it ignores the fact that all
those supposedly untrustworthy parents still control much of their
children lives -- from providing health care to nutrition, shelter,
and
raising their children -- and also are good enough for vote and choose
our representatives, approve or reject ballot measures, and run their
own lives and businesses.

Ze'ev