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Re: [Phys-l] Citations



The following three part exchange on the subject "citations (Was Re: the role of simulation)," occurred on 21 January 2008, as chronicled on the Phys-L archives at <https://carnot.physics.buffalo.edu/archives/2008/1_2008/threads.html>:

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1. Brian Blais (2008), attempting to end the bickering over whether or not John Clement had given a proper reference in an earlier post) wrote [bracketed by lines BBBBBBBBB. . . .; very slightly edited]:

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The citation is here:

"When learning about the real world is better done virtually: A study of substituting computer simulations for laboratory equipment," N. D. Finkelstein, W. K. Adams, C. J. Keller, P. B. Kohl, K. K. Perkins, N. S. Podolefsky, S. Reid, and R. LeMaster, Phys. Rev. ST Phys. Educ. Res. 1, 010103 (2005); online at
<http://link.aps.org/doi/10.1103/PhysRevSTPER.1.010103>
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Honestly, saying "Search the archives" when the citation is so easy to obtain seems to me to be saying "my time is more valuable than yours", which isn't very nice.

I think it is common internet courtesy if someone asks for reference, to give it, and not to say "oh, search the archives" or "go search this journal", unless one is referencing an entire thread (which wasn't the case here). Frankly, I have found the responses on this issue to be pretty rude! Amazing! It probably stems partly from the fact that you all know each other very well, but as primarily a lurker here, I was taken aback a bit.
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2. To which Jack Uretsky (2008) responded:

"Thanks, Brian. That's the way citations are normally given in the research community."


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3. To which John Clement 2008) replied:

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Sorry, but unfortunately, we are all in a hurry, and this is more a chat line than a scientific journal. So references are given in a hurry, and the reader may have to dig a bit. . . . . . . when someone asks for a reference, I have to go back and hunt for it. So I do get a bit testy when the information I gave is ignored. But I generally do give citations when asked, even if they are a bit messy. But make no mistake, there is a depth of literature that should be read by anyone who is teaching science. There are also relevant math research papers. Here I would cite one:

Cognitive Development, 6, 449-468 (1991)

Abstract:
It is widely assumed that instruction plays a role in learning and in transfer. The present studies examine how type of instruction (containing principle-based vs. procedure-based information) influences learning and. . . .
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . This one took me years to track down.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . CCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCC

I agree with John Clement that "we are all busy." So why doesn't John save us all some time by giving a standard academic reference to the article in "Cognitive Development "that took him years to track down?

It took me about 10 micro-years to track down Perry (1991), but if 700 Phys-L subscribers are forced to repeat that search it adds up to a waste of about 7 wo(man) milli-years!

Richard Hake, Emeritus Professor of Physics, Indiana University
24245 Hatteras Street, Woodland Hills, CA 91367
Honorary Member, Curmudgeon Lodge of Deventer, The Netherlands.
<rrhake@earthlink.net>
<http://www.physics.indiana.edu/~hake>
<http://www.physics.indiana.edu/~sdi>

REFERENCES
Blais, B. 2008. "citations (Was Re: the role of simulation)," Phys-L post of 21 Jan 2008 08:48:00-0500; online at <https://carnot.physics.buffalo.edu/archives/2008/1_2008/msg00268.html>.

Clement, J. 2008. "Citations," Phys-L post of 21 Jan 2008 13:44:53-0600; online at
<https://carnot.physics.buffalo.edu/archives/2008/1_2008/msg00271.html>.

Perry, M. 1991. "Learning and transfer: Instructional conditions and conceptual change," Cognitive Development 6(4): 449-468; abstract freely online at <http://tinyurl.com/2wd5yu>; the full article is online at <http://tinyurl.com/2rc6me>, free to subscribers, $30 for none subscribers. 4,407 links to other related articles in "Science Direct" are freely online at <http://tinyurl.com/2qackd>
Uretsky, J. 2008. "citations (Was Re: the role of simulation)," Phys-L post of 21 Jan 2008 12:42:35 -0600; online at
<https://carnot.physics.buffalo.edu/archives/2008/1_2008/msg00269.html>.