[Phys-L] Re: lightning and thunder

[John Denker <jsd@AV8N.COM>]

Anthony Lapinski wrote:

>  is there any way to have lighting without thunder,

No.

> or thunder without lightning?

No.

> I imagine if the charge is low, there might not be
> enough sound produced to audibly hear.

The event will create plenty of sound, and plenty of light.

Whether you are in a position to _observe_ the one or the
other is another question.

> Or if thunder is produced, the
> spark might be deep in the clouds and invisible to us.

Yup, especially in daytime.  The attenuation of sound
and the attenuation of light follow very different laws.

Also remember there is a huge disparity in speed of
propagation, so by the time you hear the thunder you
may have "forgotten" the associated lightning.

Also, both light and sound are _refracted_ by the
atmosphere.  Sounds created at low altitude far away
will usually be inaudible to you, because they will
be refracted upward and will pass over your head.
Conversely, if you go aloft in a balloon, you will
be amazed at how far you can hear.

In New Jersey when there is a temperature inversion
(i.e. the weather pattern *not* associated with
thunderstorms) you can often hear tremendous house-
shaking booms, due to shocks from supersonic Air Force
training missions out over the Atlantic, refracted
in the unusual downward direction by the unusual
density profile of the inversion.  The USAF is
supposed to take inversions into account when
scheduling such missions, but they don't always get
it right.
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