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Message: 1
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2016 17:36:12 +0000
From: "Forinash III, Kyle" <kforinas@ius.edu>
To: "phys-l@www.phys-l.org" <phys-l@www.phys-l.org>
Subject: Re: [Phys-L] microwave ovens
Message-ID: <30FB63AE-A03E-4798-93DA-7E486C424C68@ius.edu>
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Hi
Rob Brotherton in his book ?Suspicious Minds; why we believe conspiracy theories? (http://www.amazon.com/Suspicious-Minds-Believe-Conspiracy-Theories/dp/1472915615/ref=sr_1_9?ie=UTF8&qid=1461690107&sr=8-9&keywords=conspiracy+theory+books) makes the case that some people are more susceptible to conspiracies than others and that we all are susceptible to some degree. The tendency is that if you believe that vaccines cause autism you also believe Kennedy was killed by some mysterious cabal, microwaves cause cancer, fluorine is bad, etc. Brotherton argues these people aren?t stupid, they can give very involved, complex, logical arguments for their beliefs. But they often commit the fallacy (among others) that lack of evidence proves that something is being hidden or covered up. It is very hard to dispel that kind of thinking. The book is a fun read; I recommend it as giving insight into how conspiracists think.
As for microwaves and cell phones causing cancer; if this were true, there would have been a very dramatic and sudden increase in cancers following the widespread introduction of these devices. Historical cancer rates are available from the CDC: http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/leading-causes-of-death.htm and do not show a sudden increase (unless of course, maybe the CDC is covering up something ?.!). You CAN see a distinct increase in lung cancer in men in the 40s following the widespread increase in smoking in the 20s and 30s, followed by a parallel increase of lung cancer among women two decades later as it became more acceptable for women to smoke. Most other cancer rates have remained approximately constant since the 30s with the exception of stomach cancer which has dropped significantly since the 40s, most likely due to better diets (fresh fruits and vegetables were only available seasonally until we started importing them year round).
kyle
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Message: 2
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2016 13:57:56 -0400
From: Bill Norwood <bnorwood111@gmail.com>
To: Phys-L@phys-l.org
Subject: Re: [Phys-L] microwave ovens
Message-ID:
<CAExVuJM6Nfx_muvn5=015HB7A45x6vKzUGAUuToHevkS81FXTQ@mail.gmail.com>
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Kyle,
- While what follows might sound somewhat harsh toward you, please bear in
mind that I am acting as an advocate for our youngest members of society
who cannot possibly speak up for themselves in a qualified way.
- What you just wrote required just a few minutes of work, which falls far
short of doing your homework, as I recommended, in order to really
understand whether vaccines (and other environmental substances as well)
might cause autism.
- I did not claim that vaccines cause autism, but I have answered the
question satisfactorily for myself. I merely ask others to do the same
thing, especially if they already have small children as descendants or
will have such in the future.
- The investment of hundred of hours or so of work required to satisfy
one's own need to know, might well save the half million hours that an
unfortunate child and an unfortunate family might suffer if indeed it turns
out that either a particular vaccine, or group of vaccines, or timing of
vaccine use, or health of child at vaccination time, or combo of vaccine(s)
with other environmental contaminants. indeed did cause the autism.
- If you will indeed do your homework you will encounter both
well-referenced research denying a connection and the tearful parents who
observe their own children daily who noticed a remarkable correlation
between vaccination time and autism symptoms onset time.
- I know of some of the pain from my own family of origin as well as from
other relatives' experiences, all of which are of course anecdotes, which
is to say that of course I cannot prove for the cases I mention that
vaccines did cause the autism.
- Again, please do your homework and you will find yourself caring more
about your youngest descendants, even if they can never be anything but
anecdotes.
Thanks, Bill Norwood