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Re: [Phys-l] Mike Mann _The hockey stick and the climate wars_


On 2012, Feb 20, , at 07:31, John Clement wrote:

Well it does take time in the medical world to do confirmatory research, so
the quickly is a relative term subject to interpretation. So yes, it was
not a year or two. But the initial claims were, as I recall, fairly
outlandish, so anyone who used them to guide practice would not be
considered prudent.

One balances risk and the risk of possibly fatal
diseases is much greater than the risk of Autism.

Similarly:

My audiologist has a severely deaf child, the result of treatment of a possibly fatal disease w/ a mycin. She was warned that it was likely deafness or probably death. She thought no choice.


I will admit that I
thought it was sooner than 6 years, although it was only 4 years for
negative research to come out. The only way it could have been faster would
be to have unpublished negative research in hand. The speed of confirmation
or negation is depending on the paradigms of the researchers. When
something is "outlandish", it can be negated quickly, but is only confirmed
slowly. My example here is the "bacteria cause ulcers" research.

Well established now. Gate Keeper's master teacher's visit was interrupted by fainting and spiting up blood. Treatment w/ antibio. and out of the hospital in a few days. I think CAT confirmed perforated ulcer.



The
initial evidence was extremely persuasive, but it violated the paradigms
that physicians had at that time. So confirmation took a long time. The
old pre-antiseptic practitioners often never gave into the research so it
became standard after they retired or died.

The Semmelweis effect.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semmelweis_reflex


Ok, fraudulent is certainly faulty, but faulty is not necessarily
fraudulent. Point taken. I do sometimes try to be cautious by using mealy
mouthed verbiage.

John M. Clement
Houston, TX


bc too often is not "mealy mouthed".



-----Original Message-----
From: phys-l-bounces@carnot.physics.buffalo.edu
[mailto:phys-l-bounces@carnot.physics.buffalo.edu] On Behalf
Of chuck britton
Sent: Monday, February 20, 2012 8:41 AM
To: Forum for Physics Educators; marx@phy.ilstu.edu
Subject: Re: [Phys-l] Mike Mann _The hockey stick and the
climate wars_

I must take issue with our use of the word 'quickly' in this regard.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Wakefield
.
At 12:28 AM -0600 2/19/12, John Clement wrote:
Meanwhile there are still parents who are risking
fatal illness in their children by omitting vaccinations
because of fear
induced by a faulty Autism study, which was quickly repudiated.

Over a decade of hysteria is hard to overcome.

And the study wasn't just faulty - it was fraudulent.