Re: [Phys-l] Faith in science and/or psychology

["R. McDermott" <rmcder@gmail.com>]

I think we also have to consider another possibility (in reference to 
producing more/better scientists/engineers, etc).  Being successful in 
school, whether in physics or anything else, requires engagement of the 
student.  S/he has to think about the material, work with it, try it out, 
extend it, practice its application, etc.  A student who is naturally 
inclined and interested will do all these things pretty much despite what 
the teacher does.  Otoh, a student who is disinclined/disinterested will do 
very little in this regard.  Students in a college course are self-selected, 
and scientists/engineers come from, and are probably the best of, this 
self-selected pool.  They are also most likely to learn effectively by the 
conventional methodologies - After all, that's probably how they GOT there 
in the first place.  This may be gradually changing, but I think it is 
probably still an accurate appraisal.  PER-inspired methodologies may not, 
in fact, impact on this group significantly.  Otoh, at "lower" levels of 
physics, where we get LOT of disinterested, unmotivated students, it is 
imperative to capture their interest, and even to teach them HOW to think 
(more deeply) about the material.  I think the real impact of PER 
methodologies are experienced at these levels, where the sheer number and 
range of abilities of the students participating is far greater.  If there 
is an urgency involved in making changes in methodology, I think we in high 
school or middle school feel it more acutely.  If, otoh, the concern is the 
production of scientists/engineers, it's clear to me that we will probably 
never again be able to produce nearly the numbers or percentage domestically 
to overcome the huge disparity in population between ourselves and the Asian 
nations, so scientists/engineers are likely to more and more be a major 
export of those nations and an imported "product" for us.  We, however, may 
very well lead the world in the production of lawyers... ;-)

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John Clement" <clement@hal-pc.org>
To: "'Forum for Physics Educators'" <phys-l@carnot.physics.buffalo.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 2009 4:32 PM
Subject: Re: [Phys-l] Faith in science and/or psychology


> You say ultimately the real proof is the people coming out of the new
> pedagogy.  But how will you know them?  Do you know if any of your current
> students have come from the new pedagogy?  Why not come up with a survey
> similar to Sadler's work to try to identify what type of teaching your
> students already had, so you can judge for yourself.  Or you could contact
> their previous teachers to find out what they used in terms of curricula.
> One of the best ways to understand a type of research is to do some
> yourself.
>
> John M. Clement
> Houston, TX