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Re: [Phys-l] failure is always an option


On May 10, 2008, at 10:16 AM, Fink Trevor M wrote:

Marty,

I think the point of looking at class rank is sort of like why we have currency exchange rates, so you know what your unit of currency is worth in comparison to others. Because some areas have high grade inflation it may not be fair to say my 3.95 is actually worth more than someone else's 3.7 GPA. However, every student in a school experiences approximately the same degree of grade inflation, thereby I CAN say that my 3.95 is higher than a 3.7 at the same school.

That is how they do class rank. So what's the difference? If a 3.95 in one school is not the same as a 3.95 in another school but both are no. 1 the university admissions already knows the difference or should know that a Number 20 from one school is a better prospect than a number 2 from another. If they do not do their homework, then shame on them.
I would trust to say (and Dr. Edmonds and other professors here can chime in, please) college admissions people do their homework and either already know what type of high school these kids are applying from or if not they simply Google the district and know in an instant. Around here all you have to do at Penn or Rutgers admissions is mention the district and they know all about it from previous experience. But, if a South Jersey kid were to apply to Bluffton the admissions would probably have to do some digging. However, I do know that colleges as far away as California know a lot about the better districts in South Jersey. Mention Moorestown, Haddonfield, or Cherry Hill (and some others) to some California universities and they know the quality of the applicant. (A friend of my son moved to California in his senior year of hs, and told him the universities there that he applied to were very familiar with this district.)

.The class rank seems to serve as a way to accurately compare multiple relatively closed systems on a universal scale. Again using the monies analogy, If I were to say, "I will give you one hundred for that bowl." you would have no idea how much I am actually offering because a hundred is worth different amounts depending on who is backing it and the strength of that currency. What am I offering you? 100 yen? 100 dollars? What kind of dollars, USD? How can I tell? By telling you the currency unit I am identi

It remains that GPA is the sole indicator for class rank in most districts. So they must go hand in hand. In 99% of the districts the one with the highest GPA is Numero uno. I don't know of any that might use a formula basis with points for extracurricular or sports or community service, etc. along with grade, but that could be an answer. Suppose you consider a kid who works nights to support his family and also builds houses for Habitat and plays soccer. Let's say he carries a 3.85 GPA. Another kid just goes home and studies and has a 3.90 GPA. Should the first student get points for doing all the other things and isn't he a bit more well rounded? I think a board could make that argument but most will never do something so contraversial!

Now, if you were to say check for honors and AP then you might have an argument that is actually used in some areas. I read about that somewhere, and the one who had a higher GPA with Mickey Mouse courses was ranked second and the slightly lower GPA with AP and honors was ranked first. I recall that case where the second place sued. I don't remember the outcome though. The other case I cite below happened a few years ago and was in one of the best school districts in the state and nationally ranked for academics. It made headlines statewide and some national papers carried it.

fying where that 100 units stand relative to its peers (other currencies). Similarly, if I say I have a 3.8 GPA that means very little compared to I have a 3.8 GPA and was ranked 12 out of 700 (unlikely, but used to illustrate a point...how much more value does that GPA now have? What conclusions are we drawing from that information?) That's all I have to say on that...in the end I think class ranking is incredibly important and I am sad to hear that some schools or districts are thinking of omitting it.

The reason they are omitting class rank is because too many students have the EXACT same GPA, well almost, if you consider down to THIRD decimal place. The best districts here have so many students taking and getting 5 and 4 on AP tests, along with their honors classes (true honors level, too: they are on a college level, just not called AP) that they all compete for that coveted valedictorian. One year the second place girl SUED the board because the tie breaker for number 1 was the FOURTH decimal place: both were well OVER 4.2 or 4.3 something, which indicated a bunch of AP classes). She lost but the board compromised and gave both of them the tie and kind of split the whole town down the middle for a while.

Marty