Re: [Phys-l] innumeracy

[MJ and DS Weiss <martweiss@earthlink.net>]

   Come on, this isn't really rocket science, but you reply as if it 
were.    You quibble over semantics but in reality it is a serious 
problem.  The public will support building a sports stadium using 
hundreds of millions in tax dollars but will reject a school budget over 
a few thousand dollars for a lunch program or a science lab.   The 
general public is numerically illiterate when it comes to things that 
affect them locally but can recite numbers and statistics about things 
that have liittle or no immediate effect over their lives:  the latest 
is the value of Michael Jackson's estate and will it be sold off.  Who 
cares?  Evidently thousands of people care, judging from the responses 
on the afternoon talk tv shows.  .    One hundred thousand people will 
go out into the pouring rain to see a professional football game, but 
will not drive five minutes to vote on school boards or council.    When 
the paper reports on salary negotiations with a star player they get 
hundreds of letters, but when the paper reports on the state test scores 
or SAT scores for all the districts in an area, nary a peep from the 
same people.
How much did some diva's dress cost at the oscars?   exciting news for 
millions of viewers.     Cost of the Superconductor at Fermi lab? 
boring to most.       

very discouraging.


Marty



John M Clement wrote:

> Numerically illiterate is not innumeracy.  Technically numeracy is the 
> understanding of numbers, not literacy in particular areas such as 
> geographical numbers...  While understanding things like the budget 
> requires both interest in the budget and numeracy.  The US budget does 
> not impinge on daily life so it is fairly irrelevant to most people. 
> Also the population of a given area is generally irrelevant to common 
> every day life.
>
> People generally can not tell you where the names for the days of the 
> week came from, the time it takes for light to travel from the sun to 
> the Earth, the location of Austria, the date (within 20 years) of the 
> Civil War, the name of the secretary of state...  All of these are 
> illiteracy, but not innumeracy.  How many can name the composer of La 
> Boheme?  Or where did Dante put Lucifer?  What colors are a Monarch 
> butterfly?  Or how about the sign "Ye olde coffe shop", how was it 
> pronounced in old English?  "The olde coffe shop", because the Y was 
> originally a thorn, with a dot over the y, which was an old English 
> letter pronounced th.
>
> It depends on what you wish to define as being literate, and in what 
> context.  While numeracy is important to understanding many numbers in 
> context, it is really a separate thing from knowing specific numbers. 
> Anyone who is numerate can understant how many millions are in a 
> billion, but may not know the national budget numbers.
>
> John M. Clement
> Houston, TX
>
>
>
>  
>
> >   Think of it this way....    ask the man on the street about 
> > points 
> > or salaries in any sport and he can talk your ears off about 
> > over/under, 
> > point spread betting on the game, how much money the wide receiver 
> > gets, 
> > the longest field goal ever made, and a host of other trivial (to 
> > us) 
> > nonsense.  But, ask him about the local school budget or how much 
> > money 
> > is allocated for a highway project, or even money spent daily on the 
> > war,  and you will get blank stares.
> >
> >   This entire country is numerically illiterate except for sports 
> > trivia!
> >
> >   This happens every day at the gym I go to.    If the conversation 
> > is 
> > on sports it draws a dozen people.  Once someone turns to any other 
> > topic involving numbers most of them drift away.    
> >
> >
> > Marty
> >
> > Rick Tarara wrote:
> >
> >    
> >
> > > Common now John, the population of the country you live in, the world 
> > > you 
> > > live on, that cities have millions of people--thus is not specialized 
> > > knowledge.   These numbers effect almost every field of study--if 
> > > only to 
> > > estimate how many books your memoirs might sell!   You are sounding 
> > > like an 
> > > apologist for ignorance.  ;-(
> > >
> > > Rick
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > > From: "John M Clement" <clement@hal-pc.org>
> > >
> > >
> > >       
> > >
> > > > This question is not a test of innumeracy, except possibly at the 
> > > > ends
> > > > of the spectrum.  It is a test of crystallized knowledge.  A real 
> > > > test
> > > > for numeracy is to have people compare numbers like 0.5 and 3/8.  The
> > > > population of a given area is what might be called common shared
> > > > knowledge. 
> > > >   
> > > >
> > > >        
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> > >
> > >
> > >      
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