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Re: electric power surplus

Why is a generation too long? I can walk outside my office here in
Providence, take a deep breath on this nice late summer day, and feel
wonderful. I don't feel any pain from taking the breath - I not going to
drop dead any significant time sooner. Yes, it would be nice, I guess,
for the air to have absolutely no man-made pollutants in it, and yes, it
might be nice to live the few extra hours or days that the current level
of pollution might be taking from me - but this is hardly a crisis
situation that demands an all or nothing reduction in pollutants this
very instant. I agree with Rick, that an incremental approach
concentrating on new power plants, factories, and buildings coming on
line is more than sufficient. I don't want to significantly harm myself,
or my daughter, or her future children with dangerous pollutants. But I
also don't want to take extreme action to eliminate the current minor
levels of pollution and cause a radical change in the economy of the
country and my manner of living. Life is good - right now - and I want
my offspring to enjoy a similar lifestyle. There's time enough to get
to where we want to be.

Bob at PC

John Barrer wrote:

It's all a matter of where one places one's
priorities. And, what's your evidence for "BIG"?
Compared to what? I think a generation is way too
long. Again, the issue is the real costs that are
borne by "others". Other people's pain like other
people's $$ is all-too-easily ignored. Barrere
--- Rick Tarara <rtarara@SAINTMARYS.EDU> wrote:
Sure you can have cleaner power and
manufacturing--but how quickly do you
want it. If tomorrow (or within a decade) then
expect to pay BIG bucks to
get it. If you regulate for new construction or
provide a reasonable
timetable for retrofitting, then you can have it in
a generation or so at a
modest cost. Seems to me that we are on the latter
course. It's the huge
number of power plants/manufacturing facilities that
is the hang-up.

Rick


*********************************************************
Richard W. Tarara
Professor of Physics
Saint Mary's College
Notre Dame, Indiana
rtarara@saintmarys.edu

********************************************************
Free Physics Educational Software (Win & Mac)
www.saintmarys.edu/~rtarara/software.html
NEW: Mac versions of Lab Simulations

********************************************************
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Barrer" <forcejb@YAHOO.COM>
To: <PHYS-L@lists.nau.edu>
Sent: Friday, September 13, 2002 10:59 AM
Subject: Re: electric power surplus


Why do folks so often present these arguments as
either/or??? It IS possible to operate power
plants,
chemical plants, etc. with very low pollution
impacts.
It's just easier and often cheaper to do otherwise
as
long as the indirect costs of pollution can be
passed
on to others. John BArrere
--- Rick Tarara <rtarara@SAINTMARYS.EDU> wrote:
And do you want to return to the days of mud
streets
filled with horse
manure, to outhouses, to no medical technology
and
rampant disease, to
(more) widespread ignorance, etc? The problem
is
that you can't selectively
turn back the clock--keep the good and discard
what
_you_ dislike. What you
might want to keep (say medical tech and
sanitation)
depends on those nasty
old power plants and chemical plants!

Rick




*********************************************************
Richard W. Tarara
Professor of Physics
Saint Mary's College
Notre Dame, Indiana
rtarara@saintmarys.edu



********************************************************
Free Physics Educational Software (Win & Mac)
www.saintmarys.edu/~rtarara/software.html
NEW: Mac versions of Lab Simulations



********************************************************

----- Original Message -----
From: "Sam Sampere" <sampere@PHYSICS.SYR.EDU>
To: <PHYS-L@lists.nau.edu>
Sent: Friday, September 13, 2002 7:23 AM
Subject: Re: electric power surplus


The Labor Day storms knocked out power here
for
almost one week and
people were in agony! I loved it. The
evenings
were so peaceful and
quiet. I'd love to go back to a time when
there
were way less people on
the planet, and they all knew how to survive
despite what Mother Nature
threw at them.

Sam

John Barrer wrote:

Do yu think you're being funny? You're not.
John
Barrere
--- Bob LaMontagne
<rlamont@POSTOFFICE.PROVIDENCE.EDU>
wrote:
Power plants, oil refineries, factories,
hospitals -
they're all ugly,
smelly, and ruin the environment of those
who
live
within 1000 ft of them.
Let's shut 'em all down. I say 6000 BC
now!

Bob at PC


Tina Fanetti wrote:

And that because of needless
environmental
regulation
and insufficient investment in electric
power
production.<<<

Why are you saying that the
environmental
regulation is needless? Ha=
ve you ever lived by a power plant??

Tina

Tina Fanetti
Physics Instructor
Western Iowa Technical Community College
4647 Stone Ave
Sioux City IA 51102
712-274-8733 ext 1429



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