Chronology Current Month Current Thread Current Date
[Year List] [Month List (current year)] [Date Index] [Thread Index] [Thread Prev] [Thread Next] [Date Prev] [Date Next]

Re: Ideocosmology



Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 21:17:03 -0500
Reply-to: phys-l@mailer.uwf.edu
From: Jerome Epstein <jerepst@worldnet.att.net>
To: phys-l@atlantis.uwf.edu
Subject: Re: Ideocosmology

In response to Richard Hake's comments:


I spoke to a supervisor at City College in this TOC
program, saying that we wouldn't dream of sending someone
with a 4th grade reading level in to teach elementary
school, but we send teachers with a fourth grade math
level in to teach elementary school all the time. The
supervisor replied (roughly) as follows: That is because
large parts of the education establishment, from the
Ph.D.'s on down, are math phobic.


How true it is. We are in an ongoing struggle about math requirements for
our graduates. Several of the programs that use our service math courses
requested we write an "alternative" math course for their majors since the
one others took was "not relevant". Our math people wrote one and it was
rejected as "too mathy" (maybe not the exact phrase they used). Instead, the
programs convened a committee of their own with a few hand picked math
faculty and developed a course. This one had rudimentary 4th grade math
skills in it. I protested loudly throughout the process but the
powers-that-be from the deans on up are incredible math phobics. I suggested
that if we asked for an "alternative" English comp. course which we had
written and which was basically Spelling 101 they would scream bloody
murder. They didn't see the analogy.

My favorite quote was "The majors in the (fill-in-the-blank) program don't
NEED that much math." I pointed out that they probably don't NEED that much
humanities, etc. either if you want to use the narrowly defined job
qualifications that seemed to be their guideline.


Many is the time that I have heard various administrators (almost proudly)
announce their complete incompetence in mathematics.

Gang:
It may be that I should have sent this to Jerry by private
e-mail, but I thought others might like to see the message.
In particular, Jerry states that "cute" little courses in
"remedial algebra" will not cure the problem, BUT it can be
cured. Does the cure lie in other kinds of "remedial
courses"? or does it lie in requiring that students have a
certain level of understanding before they are admitted to
college? Of course, we would all like to see the students
be successful, BUT what can we do to help the poorly
prepared to catch up? Maybe the only thing that will help
is to start working to improve the secondary schools.
Maybe we need to try to help some of our struggling
secondary-school teachers with some ideas and short
in-service courses at the universities.


As an "open access" institution, we accept everybody who managed to obtain a
high school diploma or GED. We have an extensive set of developmental math
courses that are tied to an incoming assessment. The system does seem to
work in that the students who come into my physics courses have the math
knowledge I expect. However, I also only get the students in certain majors
- the majors that the most mathematically adept students are likely to choose.
R. Allen Shotwell
Chair, Science and Math
Ivy Tech State College
Terre Haute, IN USA