Re: Order being born from disorder?

[LUDWIK KOWALSKI <kowalskil@alpha.montclair.edu>]

1) I am sorry the word "entropy" was introduced into my message. The 
   terms "order" is "disorder" would certainly be sufficient (see below). 
   
2) I suppose that entropy was discussed on phys-L when I was away. Sure
   "the disorder in the universe" increased through my manipulations;
   it was higher at the beginning (before throwing particles into air in
   order to distribute them uniformly over the surface of a dish) than
   at the end (getting rid of them). But during the limited time of my 
   experiments randomness seems to be reduced, spontaneously. Do not take 
   my word for this. Experiment and either confirm or deny the existance 
   of particle clustering on the surface of water. I am not totally sure
   that the evolutions toward less randomness are real. It is hard to be
   objective.

3) I do remember reading that cryptologists can assign "entropy" to coded 
   messages. The messages are treated as sets of immaterial particles 
   (words and sentences). These do not interact with forces and are not
   influenced by temperature (except in hot debates). In what units do 
   they express entropy?
                                                       Ludwik Kowalski

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    Ludwik wrote:
> >  Small pieces move randomly till they meet and link permanently by 
> >  molecular forces. The irreversibility of linking is the mechanism by 
> >  which "order is born from disorder". I am using these strong words 
> >  without any evidence that the entropy of a clustered pattern is lower 
> >  than the entropy of a really random distribution for a given number
> >  of particles. Any idea how to calculate the entropy of a pattern?

  Leigh responded:                           
> Sure, but entropy has very little to do with order, a drum I've beaten
> here before. I assure you that the entropy of the system increases (and
> I'll tell you how if you don't figure it out first yourself) when the
> particles stick together. You may also perceive that the order increases,
> and I would agree with you. That should be sufficient to rupture your
> implicit connection between entropy and disorder.
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